tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post5825824112904958262..comments2023-10-30T08:41:06.178-07:00Comments on Inside the Law School Scam: Law school climate changeLawProfhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05174586969709793419noreply@blogger.comBlogger39125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-642320553279594422011-10-27T01:14:42.133-07:002011-10-27T01:14:42.133-07:00@8.16 - Right. Blogging, at least in my unqualific...@8.16 - Right. Blogging, at least in my unqualificed opinion, is about writing whatever the hell you like whenever the hell you like. That said, Campos should keep this blog going because, in the ,end, it's not the 100-comment threads that will get the change he wants to see accomplished, it's continuining to make a splash with the academic community, and hopefully getting a significant portion of the academic community behind a petition asking for change.Gilman Grundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06607416440240634159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-90915865365958077002011-10-26T20:16:19.502-07:002011-10-26T20:16:19.502-07:00To the people denigrating Campos and the important...To the people denigrating Campos and the important work he accomplishes with this blog: STFU and go away.Anonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-58408982474164085942011-10-26T18:29:15.941-07:002011-10-26T18:29:15.941-07:00"At the end of the day, man-made global warmi..."At the end of the day, man-made global warming consists of:<br />-a political movement that seeks to increase taxes and put control of manufacturing, transportation and energy into the hands of a few bureaucrats"<br /><br />I prefer going with the "Idiot's guide to reality approach"<br /><br /><br />What's a more likely explanation: <br /><br />1) Those that believe in global warning are full of shit because they are part of bureaucratic conspiracy motivated by a delusional religious belief in the earth and desire to tax people.<br /><br />OR<br /><br />2) Those opposing it are full of shit because they are motivated by money and ticked off people are limiting their ability to make money by doing what they please to the air, water, and soil.<br /><br />Tough call.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15729532031872959652noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-76250724584945857452011-10-26T15:54:53.616-07:002011-10-26T15:54:53.616-07:00This whole analogy is a mess because global warmin...This whole analogy is a mess because global warming is completely fabricated. The data was all heavily massaged and by "massaged," I mean that it was altered by the application of correction factors that had the effect of producing a warming effect where the data did not suggest one. <br /><br />And that was in the studies where the data wasn't outright fabricated. <br /><br />At the end of the day, man-made global warming consists of:<br />-a political movement that seeks to increase taxes and put control of manufacturing, transportation and energy into the hands of a few bureaucrats<br />-a bunch of scientific reports that were based on fabricated data or secret calculations and formulas (ie, non peer reviewable) <br />-a big media push focused around getting the general public into a panic over their impending death from global warming<br /><br />A similar thing was done with the ozone bullshit back in the 70s, but the internet wasn't around to debunk it and the guys got nobel prizes instead of public humiliation.Jim Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09565551744576464415noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-18174221132456792972011-10-26T14:28:10.436-07:002011-10-26T14:28:10.436-07:000Ls don't read the scamblogs, whether written ...0Ls don't read the scamblogs, whether written by a graduate or a professor. They read other, more optimistic, sites.<br /><br />No one likes to be told that they are making a mistake.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-6070696594142836682011-10-26T13:37:12.588-07:002011-10-26T13:37:12.588-07:00@1:24pm The student loan crisis is going to be far...@1:24pm The student loan crisis is going to be far larger than the mortgage crisis(Look at the numbers). And unlike a home, which can be foreclosed upon, and resold---albeit at a lower price, an education cannot be repackaged and resold for newfound value in an environment where there are no jobs. Unlike property that can be transferred or sold, an education remains fundamentally with you always. If there is no value in it and one cannot include the associated education loans in a bankruptcy, then the solutions that, at the very least, are available during this on-going mortgage crisis aren't even touched upon for education loans. Yes, there is IBR, but that is it---and it readily narrows down your employment opportunities, if any.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-73049313419939537052011-10-26T13:26:20.832-07:002011-10-26T13:26:20.832-07:00Like I've said before, this blog has become &q...<i>Like I've said before, this blog has become "just another scamblog," and that is exactly what Lemuel has described.</i><br /><br />There is a very important difference between this blog and the others: This one has special credibility because it is written by someone on the inside. It's easy for 0Ls to dismiss warnings coming from a graduate who can't find a job ("that won't be me" etc.). It's not so easy to dismiss warnings coming from one of the very people who are trying to get your money.Lemuelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-68194863850049067682011-10-26T13:24:59.220-07:002011-10-26T13:24:59.220-07:00The avarice and greed of these law school will not...The avarice and greed of these law school will not be entertained or humored by bankers or the taxpayers. No money from the banks or government after next year's massive economic downturn will finally destroy the tier 4's and then the tier 3's before it starts to affect the tier 2's and tier 1's in the the next 2-3 years. In addition Obama's defeat, rightly or wrongly, will result in a Tea Party-led gutting of government spending and programs.<br />------------<br /><br />Banks are irrelevant because loans come from the government now, and I don't see the Tea party cutting education when they have bigger fish to fry.<br /><br />The only way the taxpayer funded loan thing helps, IMHO, is if a US Attorney uses it as a basis to file a fraud lawsuit against the schools similar to what happened to Solyndra.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-20406228747061331452011-10-26T13:05:59.910-07:002011-10-26T13:05:59.910-07:00Ultimately, it will be the financial repercussions...Ultimately, it will be the financial repercussions like the increasing default rates, which will bring these law schools and, in general, higher education institutions to their knees. The avarice and greed of these law school will not be entertained or humored by bankers or the taxpayers. No money from the banks or government after next year's massive economic downturn will finally destroy the tier 4's and then the tier 3's before it starts to affect the tier 2's and tier 1's in the the next 2-3 years. In addition Obama's defeat, rightly or wrongly, will result in a Tea Party-led gutting of government spending and programs. The forces are all coming together to crush the DENIERS and awaken the SLEEPERS. Quietly, Madame Defarge sits in her corner knitting away.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-17034822316506178002011-10-26T13:04:47.422-07:002011-10-26T13:04:47.422-07:00Did we prepare the website listing all professors ...Did we prepare the website listing all professors along with whether they were willing to sign the petition yet?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-10984475011984459332011-10-26T12:59:17.136-07:002011-10-26T12:59:17.136-07:00The guy is one tenured law professor, who doesn...The guy is one tenured law professor, who doesn't teach at one of the elite schools, out of thousands. What exactly do you expect him to do right now? It's not as if he's taking up valuable column space in the Scamblogger Newspaper.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-47734479097266387062011-10-26T12:52:23.254-07:002011-10-26T12:52:23.254-07:00http://www.jdjournal.com/2011/10/25/law-school-loa...http://www.jdjournal.com/2011/10/25/law-school-loan-provider-calling-it-quits/<br /><br />This above article is evidence that even the lenders don't see these loans as profitable for themselves. <br /><br />And with the report from today that the federal student loan default rate has jumped 25% in the past year, there is even further evidence that the lenders, like the students, are not getting a good return on their investment either. (see below)<br /><br />http://www.cnbc.com/id/45040668Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-42431140718081665012011-10-26T12:17:08.409-07:002011-10-26T12:17:08.409-07:00quoted from Lemuel, above: "...this blog can ...quoted from Lemuel, above: "...this blog can still perform an important service by getting some greater number of 0Ls to realize that yes, law school is not worth it for the vast majority of students, and that this is not simply a temporary problem."<br /><br />Like I've said before, this blog has become "just another scamblog," and that is exactly what Lemuel has described.<br /><br />That's a huge disappointment, because any disgruntled current of former law student can write about their law school experience and debt, but a tenured law professor ought to be able to do more.<br /><br />Might as well shut her down, because there are enough scamblogs out there repeating the complaints about employment numbers, uncaring faculty, and law school expense.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-70726838826593003822011-10-26T11:47:25.161-07:002011-10-26T11:47:25.161-07:00Maybe LawProf is being too general. Maybe law pro...Maybe LawProf is being too general. Maybe law professors realize there is a problem in general, but don't think there is a problem at their school. LawProf needs to call out the worst offenders.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-52091164137021024032011-10-26T11:43:25.950-07:002011-10-26T11:43:25.950-07:00Thanks for the suggestions for topics, which are a...Thanks for the suggestions for topics, which are always welcome. I'll write on the one suggested by Lemuel tomorrow.LawProfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05174586969709793419noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-78945288418887434052011-10-26T11:34:04.111-07:002011-10-26T11:34:04.111-07:00Lemuel--
You are correct that the more hits this B...Lemuel--<br />You are correct that the more hits this Blog gets the more it will show up on the search engines. I agree that this blog should stay alive and that suggested topics like you and Shark Sandwich(!)have put forth is a great technique. We need to wake up the sleepers, that is clear. In my experience, most of the sleepers are hard working, good hearted people who really care about students and the institution. The problem is that too few of them have contact with the outside world, particularly small firm and solo practitioners. I had the good fortune to work with the local bar association on many matters over the years, but my experience is not shared by many of my colleagues. The bottom line is that we need to do a lot of educating the educators before things will change. But, they will change. There have been several "paradigm shifts" in legal education in my 44 years and I sense another one coming soon!Law Office Computinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16741029082116341276noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-85225098198587236002011-10-26T11:23:19.004-07:002011-10-26T11:23:19.004-07:00@Lemuel - Matches my experiences, but then I usual...@Lemuel - Matches my experiences, but then I usually like the people I read not to simply write things that play to my prejudices.Gilman Grundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06607416440240634159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-20220133665024213692011-10-26T11:04:27.546-07:002011-10-26T11:04:27.546-07:00"Something I'd be interested in hearing a..."Something I'd be interested in hearing about is how law professors tend to view their students, including whether they only really care about the top x%, so that bad outcomes for everyone else don't really matter to professors."<br /><br />I'd like to hear about this, too.Shark Sandwichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08866373313029422313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-16349857357241934002011-10-26T10:05:07.469-07:002011-10-26T10:05:07.469-07:00@Breezy: Maybe we could suggest topics that we...@Breezy: Maybe we could suggest topics that we'd like LawProf to discuss? Something I'd be interested in hearing about is how law professors tend to view their students, including whether they only really care about the top x%, so that bad outcomes for everyone else don't really matter to professors.Lemuelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-16429330809985250872011-10-26T09:43:23.995-07:002011-10-26T09:43:23.995-07:00Lemuel: I can certainly appreciate that. I don'...Lemuel: I can certainly appreciate that. I don't mind the mission-creep that will inevitably settle in. A blog about the current crisis in legal education certainly could branch out into discussions about the shoddy teaching, the ridiculous assessment techniques and the raw lack of practical usefulness of a legal education.<br /><br />All of that would be against the backdrop of "you're paying HOW MUCH for HOW CRAPPY a product?!"<br /><br />And everyone can have an off day. Today's installment is certainly an "off day" even by the liberal standards of blogs. This reads more like a conversation you have at the bar, "Hey hey check this out, people X are just like people Y in this controversial setting!"<br /><br />Take it as a sign of how much I appreciate this blog and respect what LawProf is doing here that an entry like this gets a head-wagging post of disapproval from me, as if my opinion matters :P<br /><br />b.BreezyWheezehttp://www.fark.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-27663615657941568572011-10-26T09:10:03.077-07:002011-10-26T09:10:03.077-07:00I don't think it really matters whether a give...I don't think it really matters whether a given post on this blog is useless. IMO, what's important is that the blog remain <i>active</i>, so that 0Ls who may be wondering about the wisdom of attending law school will find the blog readily. Maybe Law Office Computing can correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand, most search engines tend to move to the top of search results pages that are frequently/more recently updated. Even if there are no institutional reforms, this blog can still perform an important service by getting some greater number of 0Ls to realize that yes, law school is not worth it for the vast majority of students, and that this is not simply a temporary problem. The odds of someone finding this blog will go way down if it vegetates.Lemuelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-25015664526439395962011-10-26T08:39:01.585-07:002011-10-26T08:39:01.585-07:00I think the job market thing is really hard to get...I think the job market thing is really hard to get across to people. I was in that situation myself (working now) and I remember sending the resumes and cover letters and getting no responses but it's quickly becoming a fading memory. It's something that's extremely difficult to relate to when you're employed, especially if you've never experienced it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-11045032930378588232011-10-26T08:37:34.552-07:002011-10-26T08:37:34.552-07:00Sorry for the double post. The first did not show ...Sorry for the double post. The first did not show up for a while.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-48053599371163558062011-10-26T08:36:37.799-07:002011-10-26T08:36:37.799-07:00Law schools, and law professors, are not all the s...Law schools, and law professors, are not all the same. My interactions with law professors indicate that they know how much it costs to go to their schools.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-58521362214183559642011-10-26T08:33:46.784-07:002011-10-26T08:33:46.784-07:00Law schools are different. My interactions with pr...Law schools are different. My interactions with profs indicate they know very well how much it costs to go to their schools.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com