tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post4340237772001046548..comments2023-10-30T08:41:06.178-07:00Comments on Inside the Law School Scam: The startling gap in Michigan's salary statsLawProfhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05174586969709793419noreply@blogger.comBlogger82125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-39694213726862052842011-12-29T13:19:01.170-08:002011-12-29T13:19:01.170-08:00"but what's the point of getting aboard t..."but what's the point of getting aboard that train in the first place?"<br /><br />So that you get to be an indentured slave and enable your law school professors and administrators to earn obscene salary and pensions for doing little to no work. Someone has to pay the loans to keep the scam going.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-67359396938960384802011-12-29T11:55:57.306-08:002011-12-29T11:55:57.306-08:00As I said , people should do what they want to do....As I said , people should do what they want to do. My only point was that you do not have to live in Manhattan if you work at a firm there. <br /><br />Scrimping and saving is what many people do when they start out.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-81609441125412790722011-12-29T11:55:30.795-08:002011-12-29T11:55:30.795-08:00Because freedom feels amazing.Because freedom feels amazing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-31832398549656032122011-12-29T11:33:30.838-08:002011-12-29T11:33:30.838-08:00Hi. 9:22 and 9:53 here. The availability of tran...Hi. 9:22 and 9:53 here. The availability of transportation is not really the issue. <br /><br />If an associate lives somewhere where the path would be required to go, when that associate goes home in a car after 8, 9 or whatever the rule is at that particular firm, the client ends up picking up the tab for a radically more expensive ride, complete with tolls and a different zone designation. But that's not really the point.<br /><br />But that's not really the point.<br /><br />The point is that if you are in a position where you have to work in biglaw and scrimp and save, you are doubling down on your misery. I scrimped and saved when I was an assistant DA. It was the down side of having a fun job that I loved. My friend that left finance to become a high school math teacher scrimps and saves. <br /><br />Yes, scrimping and saving will help you pay down your loans if you work in biglaw, but what's the point of getting aboard that train in the first place?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-61106604629182613132011-12-29T11:22:13.718-08:002011-12-29T11:22:13.718-08:00The PATH goes to Midtown,too.The PATH goes to Midtown,too.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-17307332587733954432011-12-29T11:15:05.240-08:002011-12-29T11:15:05.240-08:00Yup (to Bl1Y)Yup (to Bl1Y)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-34147026005808802222011-12-29T10:46:37.451-08:002011-12-29T10:46:37.451-08:00@10:12: What is Cleary, Milbank, or Strook?
Your ...@10:12: What is Cleary, Milbank, or Strook?<br /><br />Your options are obviously very different if your firm is located in the WTC/FiDi area.<br /><br />@9:22 is exactly right about the bargain. If you go the Big Law route from a top school, the expectation is that you'll spend three years of your life in an overcharged, stressful, competitive environment, fork over $120,000 in tuition, and when you graduate you'll work 10-12 hour days, be available 18 hours a day, and work your ass off; but, in return you'll have interesting work, a bit of social prestige, and enough money to enjoy an upper-middle class life.<br /><br />Nowadays, the work is dull and meaningless, there's no prestige in it, and with a massive debt load, the money isn't even that great. It's good money, no doubt, but not enough to make the bargain worthwhile.BL1Yhttp://www.constitutionaldaily.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-7391280490539732732011-12-29T10:43:06.624-08:002011-12-29T10:43:06.624-08:00And whether they should go to law school...And whether they should go to law school...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-38402334482384102902011-12-29T10:33:01.906-08:002011-12-29T10:33:01.906-08:00The level of paternalism that comes out in these c...The level of paternalism that comes out in these comments about where people live, what they eat, and how they spend is frightening.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-29962826642520297282011-12-29T10:12:41.737-08:002011-12-29T10:12:41.737-08:00That was not the way it was at my firm. Many young...That was not the way it was at my firm. Many younger associates lived in Brooklyn. Some lived in Jersey City and Hoboken and used the PATH to get into the City. A number started in Manhattan, but migrated out after a couple of years.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-86179516898373723472011-12-29T09:53:22.649-08:002011-12-29T09:53:22.649-08:00When I briefly worked in biglaw the firm had a lit...When I briefly worked in biglaw the firm had a little address book directory type of thing for the entire firm. I kept because it was interesting from a cultural/socio-economic point of view. The partners lived either in nice suburbs or what I'll call grown up parts of manhattan, e.g. park avenue. The associates by and large lived in other areas of manhattan, e.g. yorkville and chelsea. Of the non-lawyer staff, those on the younger and maybe more highly compensated side lived in mildly fashionable areas of the outer boroughs- certain brooklyn neighborhoods, maybe astoria. The older staff primarily lived in unhip, unglamorous parts of the Bronx, Brooklyn and Queens. The atmosphere at the firm was nice though, face to face, we all pretended like we had similar lives.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-60291028067919312072011-12-29T09:35:08.045-08:002011-12-29T09:35:08.045-08:00This is information that could be gathered. But I ...This is information that could be gathered. But I would be surprised if a huge number of young lawyers who work at firms in NYC did not live some place other than Manhattan.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-49958095817429772382011-12-29T09:28:40.455-08:002011-12-29T09:28:40.455-08:009:22 is right. Scrimping and saving is a not a lon...9:22 is right. Scrimping and saving is a not a long-term strategy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-23944589339710038092011-12-29T09:22:31.652-08:002011-12-29T09:22:31.652-08:00I just want to comment briefly on the get roommate...I just want to comment briefly on the get roommates, bring your lunch, live outside manhattan advice/debate. While that might all be good advice, and help you pay off your loans more quickly, you're misunderstanding the biglaw bargain- they ask you to work lots of hours and even more than just work the hours, be available, i.e., responsive to e-mails on your blackberry at any time. In exchange, when you do get out of work, you get to take a quick ride home, to somewhere decent, with enough money in your pocket to pick up some grub, and if you ever get to take a vacation, you have enough money to be able to afford to go somewhere. That's the deal. <br /><br />Second, vis a vis client development, that you might become important later in your career, when your firm is telling you that your work is good, but you don't have a future at the firm, its important to be a social person. Social people, people who are well liked, and who know lots of other people- those are rainmakers. The people eating tuna sandwiches at their desk, taking the train out to Queens, those are not social people. There are exceptions of course, but the whole scrimp and save to make it work deal- that's what you do if you take a pleasant job that allows you to have a life.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-5656827288092874212011-12-29T07:49:42.101-08:002011-12-29T07:49:42.101-08:00Oh OK then I have no problem supporting a writer.Oh OK then I have no problem supporting a writer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-3227797396761606672011-12-29T07:33:18.301-08:002011-12-29T07:33:18.301-08:00Lawyerist pays its writers based on traffic. Susan...Lawyerist pays its writers based on traffic. Susan is just trying to squeeze out a couple extra bucks by linking from this site.BL1Yhttp://www.constitutionaldaily.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-81577576010811034832011-12-28T21:44:50.061-08:002011-12-28T21:44:50.061-08:00Susan,
I just read your post and it's a comple...Susan,<br />I just read your post and it's a complete load of shit. Exactly what school do you think does all the things you listed in your article, because we can speak with their alumni to confirm that you're wrong.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-3304478261156300882011-12-28T21:14:25.546-08:002011-12-28T21:14:25.546-08:00Here is a helpful blog post explaining how law car...Here is a helpful blog post explaining how law career services offices collect employment statistics:<br /><br />http://lawyerist.com/law-school-employment-data-one-student-at-a-time/Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00817493814932113089noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-3300434058075253752011-12-28T20:05:53.771-08:002011-12-28T20:05:53.771-08:00Apropos of the escort talk, and the law school sca...Apropos of the escort talk, and the law school scam:<br /><br />Dear Steve,<br /><br />I have defaulted on $90,000 in student loans. The remainder of my loans (I believe they are now somewhere around $100,000) are in forbearance. Last year I made a total of about $40,000, first as a temporary administrative assistant and then as a full-time employee of a corporation. Unable to find a job, I attempted to start my own law practice, which was almost as much of a waste of time and money as getting a law degree. I foresaw disaster in 2008 when some of my loans went into repayment. I called my lender, Citibank, several times to see if we could work out a payment plan that I could stick to but was told multiple times that my only option was default. By 2009 I had used all the deferment and forbearance time for certain loans.<br /><br />I now take home $3600 a month as a legislative analyst. I live in a hovel in New York, paying $1,200 a month for rent and, in the winter, more than $200 a month for gas and electricity. I cannot find a landlord who will rent to me given my credit score (which says nothing about my history of paying rent on time–fortunately, I have had no problems paying rent yet). I would like to move to a cheaper apartment, but I’m afraid that won’t be possible with my credit score. If I move back in with my parents, I will have to quit my job. My parents live in a small town in Texas. I’m not sure what my job prospects would be there.<br /><br />According to Citibank, my defaulted loans have been sold, but according to the collections agency, DCS, they have not. I really don’t know their status, other than that they are in default. I know that I cannot get a pay raise at my job because salaries have been frozen for three years, so I am currently applying for higher paying jobs and hoping that the hiring companies don’t require a credit check. I have looked into escort services as a way to make money on the side but am terrified of being raped or getting an STD and frankly don’t think there is much of a market for someone who looks like me.<br /><br />I guess my question is whether I should try anything else before committing suicide. I understand that nothing is free, including “education,” but I feel that now I am being disproportionately punished for my crime of stupidity (the crime of thinking that I could go to law school, become a lawyer, and make enough money to pay for law school and lead a better life than my parents have led). I am completely miserable and see no hope whatsoever, especially in light of the fact that people who owe less than a quarter of what I owe are contemplating suicide.<br /><br />I would greatly appreciate a response, even if it is just to confirm that there is no hope.<br /><br />Thank you.<br /><br /><br />http://getoutofdebt.org/27444/student-loans-and-suicide-im-a-lawyer-living-in-a-hovel-in-new-york-with-private-student-loan-debt-and-thinking-of-becoming-an-escortAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-50930220510014232302011-12-28T18:39:07.398-08:002011-12-28T18:39:07.398-08:00Don't forget the $30 sushi dinner!Don't forget the $30 sushi dinner!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-853160851133984812011-12-28T18:37:39.993-08:002011-12-28T18:37:39.993-08:00That's why I study so hard. One day I'll h...That's why I study so hard. One day I'll have a nice office at a Wall Street firm where after working past 11PM one night I can order a beautiful Ukranian woman from my firm's preferred services. Looking out on the Manhattan skyline, merger documents on my desk as she walks in. What a life. What a life that will be.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-66582477126884509212011-12-28T18:32:12.400-08:002011-12-28T18:32:12.400-08:00You mean paralegals?
No, really though, escort se...You mean paralegals?<br /><br />No, really though, escort services in NYC aren't a secret.BL1Yhttp://www.constitutionaldaily.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-13736042395317758752011-12-28T18:13:03.932-08:002011-12-28T18:13:03.932-08:00BL1Y, Is it true that NYC biglaw firms have a secr...BL1Y, Is it true that NYC biglaw firms have a secret list of escorts you can call to release the tension?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-73290827196780744222011-12-28T18:01:34.793-08:002011-12-28T18:01:34.793-08:00I took lunch with me to work plenty of times. Not ...I took lunch with me to work plenty of times. Not really to save money, but because other than Sinigual, the food in the area was crap.<br /><br />Being stuck at your desk all day sucks though, and eating lunch at your desk just makes it that much more miserable.<br /><br />You definitely can make the money work, but I guess my bigger point is that people need to really be aware that winning the golden ticket - landing a Big Law job - can still be totally miserable. Long hours, stressful work, terrible coworkers, shit you don't really care about doing, and on top of it, you still have to tighten your belt and pinch pennies to pay off your loans.BL1Yhttp://www.constitutionaldaily.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5164886390834386622.post-88518293368103938682011-12-28T18:00:39.734-08:002011-12-28T18:00:39.734-08:00Fair enough. That usually only happens to me when...Fair enough. That usually only happens to me when I work with other associates and they dump the shit they don't want to do on me before they leave. Sounds like your firm is pickier about the meals than mine is, although my firm just writes off the cost of meals so they're not answering to the client about it.<br /><br />I guess some people might do that for the free meal, I think my personal time is more valuable the few evenings I can get it.5:51noreply@blogger.com